58 Willys Wagon

[FINOCJ]

Next project on the 58 has begun....time to install the vintage powr-lok limited slip differential that I built this past spring....going to do a full rebuild of the 19spline D44 as well. Unlike a lot of modern D44s, this old school one has 2-piece axle shaft and wheel hub....Getting the hub off can be the hardest part of the whole deal - a big puller helps, as well as i pulled these for brake work a few years ago. They came off pretty easy...Note the old-school inboard brake drums - those will also be replaced with a more 'modern' bendix style self-adjusting drum set-up (as compared to these OEM Wagner manual adjusters).


Getting this parking brake cable out through the backing plate was one of the PITA parts...turns out there is a special tool for this - I used a combination of pliers, vice grips, screw drivers and some well placed swearing:


Here is the special tool - photo from a friend:


There are a lot of pieces to get out before I tried to remove the entire axle housing or get R&p out.... I rebuilt the D44 in my cj, but this one definitely a bit more going on with the tapered hubs as opposed to the flanged axles...


Once the axle housing was on the bench, it was time to get the R&P out and record helpful data....and I'll put them here for future reference if needed (like I loose my notepad)...these are the 'removal' numbers
Axle shims - right side only: .085 total
.060
.010 x2
.005
*does not include the .155 retainer plate on each side

Pinon - outer (small): .071 total
.030 x2
.005
.003 x2

Pinon - inner (large): .038 total
.015 x2
.005
.003

Ring gear Backlash: .010
And a pic of the pattern before removal:


The its time to remove the R&P...


Still need to press off the inner pinon bearing, and to remove the carrier bearings - although I was hoping to wait until I had the clamshell bearing puller for that (waiting on overdue shipping). Last time i got them off with my large bearing splitter, but its not the best method, and it will probably damage them - I was hoping to make set-up bearings out of them. I can always work on getting the pinon installed with proper depth and preload while waiting....the pinon seal was at the end of its life as i could tell from the oil seepage, but it was rough enough that a bit of grit and moisture etc got in, and driving the pinon and outer bearing race out was a bigger PITA than I remembered. But overall, the bearings seem very good - guessing they never got a lot of miles on them, but mostly sat unused for many years. I replaced the gear oil a few years ago, but it was still pretty nasty....lots of carbon and thick gunk stuck on lots of stuff.


I can also work on cleaning up the housing....and the last two things still in the housing are the inner oil seals that I need to pull....one of the axle bearings look to have red grease and one was black - so someone has been in here messing with things. In both cases, the 'grease' was very stiff, and what is sitting up against the inner oil seal is maybe grease mixed with clay and whatnot all caked and dried up.


Anyway, I have all the bearings and shims etc as part of a rebuild kit I bought awhile ago, but need to order the axle/hub grease cups and oil seals....

[Jim]

That "special tool" looks like something you could make in the shop.

Are those axles considered full float?

[FINOCJ]

Jim previously posted:

[FINOCJ]

Making a bit of progress on the D44 PL install etc....got the housing cleaned up enough to get new zircs installed for the wheel bearing cavity and welded up the axle tube vent:


Got a new vent drilled, tapped and installed in the top of the housing - this is a much better location and eventually could upgrade to a threaded nipple and a hose vent extension:


Painted the housing:


Spent some time with the pinon....a couple of the first threads had some damage and I was having a lot of issue getting a nut to thread on...But after tracking down a big die at the local hardware store and a lot of stress with a file and a die, I got it cleaned up pretty good without making it worse and unusable (which was the stressfull part - didn't want to deal with replacing the R&P). Those threads look pretty good now....also pressed on the new inner bearing:


Drove in the inner bearing cup with the shims behind it - just trying to copy the existing pinon depth (although I erred on the side of a thousandth or so short on the stack instead of a thousandth or so thick - so that will raise the pinon up just a smidge (ps note - this may come back to be a concern!)....

[FINOCJ]

Next was getting the pinon preload set...put in the exact .071 outer pinon shim stack and rotational torque came out just a bit too low at 10inch-lbs.....looking for something around 15in-lbs


so drive the pinon out and pull out the thin .002 shim ---- I got it!


I am not 100% pinon depth is spot on, so going to leave the seal and slinger etc out until I get the carrier shims set and verify good pattern. It won't be fun removing the pinon again and inner cup to change those shims if needed, but will do what needs to be done to get it right. But I matched the old inner shim pack to within .001, so it's got a good chance of working as is.

Next was transfer the ring gear from the OEM open case to the PL case....


I pulled the old carrier bearings using a clamshell puller - this allowed me to not damage the old bearings upon removal so i could repurpose them into 'set-up' bearings. I ground the inside diameter of the bearing out just a bit so they would 'slip-fit' on the ends of the PL case. This allows them to be easily put on and off as the shims that go under them are fine tuned. Once the shim packs are finalized (based on R&P pattern and backlash), new bearings will get pressed on.


Now for the fun...using the thickness of the shim packs that came out, I had a starting point to try test fitting the new PL case. First attempt:
I am trying to essentially match the existing wear pattern and maybe improve the backlash just a bit from the .010" that it had previously....
Here is the new set-up pattern on the drive side:


coast side:


I think the pattern is coming out okay in terms of in terms of height between the root and crown, but seems to be too far towards the toe. Here is the old pattern again - if anything, its possibly a smidge low, but its more centered between the heel and toe:


Based on wanting to move the pattern away from the toe and towards the heel just a bit, I need to move the ring gear away from the pinon (move some shim stack from bolt side to the tooth side). Doing this will increase backlash.....The current backlash is just over .008" and I am worried that I will end up with too much backlash.

I moved the shims a bit toward the tooth side to push the ring gear away from the pinon....I went right up till the backlash was back at the max of .010 (and the same as where it was with the old case when it came out). It produced a ok pattern that mimics pretty close to what came out. The drive side is good - the coast side is still a bit towards the toe, but I would take it. I like the pattern - just wish I could squeeze the backlash down a bit. Guess I have to decide if its good as is, or if I should mess with pulling the pinon (which is a bit of a PITA) and trying to set it a bit higher (reduce the shim pack) - that would both move the pattern away from the toe, and more importantly, also raise the contact patch higher up the the flank? That would increase the backlash, so I'd also have to move some shims from the tooth side to the bolt side to offset that, and hopefully be able to get another few thousandths to across to reduce the backlash to something like .008.
Overall, I don't think this pattern is all that bad considering what it started as upon removal:

[FINOCJ]

Decided to fight it a bit more and see if I can get it better....Tore it all apart again, removed a .010 shim from the inner pinon stack (from .030 to .020)....As expected, the backlash increased so I had to move some of the shim stack from the tooth side to the bolt side...Here is the best result I found with the new pinon position and a backlash of .008 (I had trouble finding a backlash of .010 or so, it seems to jump to .012 and beyond very quickly).
Drive side is not horrible - it definitely further away from the toe, but I think its a bit too high up the tooth...



the coast side is not very good - its high and toe:


Decided the .010 reduction was too much, so I added back .004 and checked pattern, then another .002, and finally, another .002 for a total reduction from starting point of only .002. This puts me around a total shim thickness of .028. The drive side is starting to look pretty good - its nicely centered between the root and top. Its a still a bit towards the toe, but that is less important (FWIW - BL is .006):



I think one of the reasons its tempting to run the pinon even close to the ring gear centerline is the coast side...this image is not the best and kind of over emphasize the issue, but its still pretty high and towards the toe. I looked at some ghost patterns and they do look better - though not as good as the deeper position I did very first and which was similar to what it came out with.


So if going only off the drive side, I like this set up...if taking the coast side into consideration, not sure where the best compromise is. As i said, the ghost pattern seems to indicate its not as bad as the above photo, and maybe with a bit of usage, it will 'wear-in' a bit more and a larger, more centered contact patch will develop. Its also possible that increasing the backlash just a bit from .006 to .008 or so would help - and maybe would be a better target given the used gear set? Or I just go back to what I finished with yesterday and call it good - i am not seemingly getting anything that is markedly better that I can tell.

[FINOCJ]

Well, its getting close....buttoned up the carrier yesterday with the limited slip power lock case, and finished up the axle install and new upgraded 11" drum brakes - upgrade because these are self adjusting style instead of the OEM manual adjusting style. And hopefully the parking brake will work better.....


You can see in the background some leaf springs that I found cheap that I think are old Rancho 1" lift springs for a willys wagon! They are a bit crusty, so disassembled and need to clean them up a bit and put them back together. I got all 4, but just working on the rears for now. The spring pack is only 4 leaves, but they are THICK leaves - one reason to believe they are Ranchos. Anyway, they will probably ride STIFF, but given their age and use, and some cleaning and lubrification, they might work just fine. I could use a bit more clearance on the rear. If they are too much lift or too stiff, i can maybe merge a couple of the thick leaves into my old OEM soft springs and find a happy medium.

[Jim]

Congrats on getting the diff adjusted/assembled!

[FINOCJ]

Well....I think I identified the engine knock I've been chasing for a year. All driving symptoms have suggested c-rod knock developing when the engine heats up and the oil thins out, but its finally gotten loud enough that I could use a stethoscope around the block and heads at idle to begin pinpointing the location. I took it for an around the block drive on 7 cylinders, and the knock was definitely gone with #1 plug wire pulled...So it seemed time to dig into this further....results are not good:
I got the bottom cap off the #1 rod and bearing shell looks like this:


yup....crank journal is damaged as well...so the crank has to come out which basically means pulling the engine and pretty complete disassembly. Time to think about how to best move forward, if at all with this right now.

[Jim]

Ouch.

Is there time to get the task tended before jeeping season? Do you have a spare motor? Or would you slap it together*, keep driving to a minimum, and use it for the season?

* cross the fingers repair - pull the conrod bearing half (maybe not removing the head to replace it), fine grit sandpaper on the crankshaft to remove the major marks, install new bearings. How many jeeping miles would you put on this season? You'd likely always have the trailer at the trailhead... Worst case is a strap pull to trailhead.

[FINOCJ]

Jim previously posted:

[Jim]

Ah, thanks - I had CJ on my mind.

[FINOCJ]

Here are some photos of other bearings etc....
Rod bearings (top and bottom shells) for 1 and 2 that share same journal - front is to the right (so 1 is to the right) - guessing the damage to number 2 might be 'residual' from #1?:


Here is #1 main - damaged:


Here is #2 main - much less damage - just every so slight feel of something.


Here is the crank....Main 1 has a minor groove that if it was the only issue, I think you could try a little emery cloth and new bearing shells and it might work. 1/2 journal is really only an issue on the #1 side, but its not salvageable. Main 2 is in good shape.


So, mostly I was pulling these for my own interest, but at this point, I don't see any value to continue to do so....The engine has to come out, so might as well start moving in that direction. The 3 options I see going forward (other than just parking it in the corner and forgetting about it for awhile):
1) disassemble, take the rods (and attached piston as I don't deal with wrist pins) and crank to local shop for resizing and machining etc, and then reassemble. I guess technically the cylinders would need honing?, but....also not sure if this was an oiling issue, what I would need to do about that. Also, has enough metal move around that I need to worry about the cam lobes, cam bearings, oil galleys etc - Guess you could start over with this block, and get it tanked etc, honed, new cam bearing etc, and then reassemble etc - but guessing that would cost as much as other options
2) buy assembled short block, and put the rest of my stuff on it - my basic build shouldn't have any issues with matching any of the valve train components to the lower end. I sent an inquiry to S&J about short block, but don't think they sell them. Other online suppliers do....not sure who would be the best suppliers.
3) buy long block or complete crate engine....although I have good heads and whatnot, there is nothing special about the 993 iron heads.....full crate engine probably means going with a TBI vortec set-up...

[Jim]

What the heck caused this? 5000 miles since the build? Is the oil pump not pumping anywhere near spec?

[FINOCJ]

Jim previously posted:

[Jim]

If that's your thinking (sounds reasonable to me), I think I'd be testing flow for every oil passage you can locate. Blow either with air or my preference is to flow water through them as it gives a nice visual to see the flow (though surface rust is a concern).

[FINOCJ]

Engine is out along with the 465/18/OD.....
​


need to pull apart at the bellhousing and get the engine on a stand. Hoping I might be able to save the iron heads, and I have an aluminum intake that I never got put on - that would be to move past the qjet carb and do something more interesting like TBI. So that would mean maybe I can get a ready to go short block....but that also means staying with flat tappet cam and 2 piece RMS etc (these gen1 sbc just are hard to seal up - after 5000 miles the amount of oil seepage everywhere is obnoxioius). Roller cam, vortec heads, 1piece RMS would be nice, but price goes up, both for the long block and for all the additional items to fully finish it like new intake, new flywheel, new bracketry etc...

Think I want to look into the OD - its not shifting correctly. It was a used unit that I didn't rebuild, so it might need some love. I need to order a couple things from AA, so maybe new blocking ring/synchro for the OD as well.

[Mountaineer01]

Tough break James, sorry to hear! This thing was coming along so nicely too. Seeing thinks like this happen to really knowledgeable mechanics is really humbling to an amateur like myself. Good luck and I hope you can find a somewhat cost effective solution, keep us posted!

[FINOCJ]

With the engine-trans-TC-OD pulled, it seems like a good time to address a small problem I was having with the external Warn OD....it would shift up to overdrive, but it wouldn't shift back down to direct drive unless the vehicle was essentially at a stop (or very slow moving)....initial thought is something with the synchronizer blocking rings might be giving me trouble. It ran fine in either range, but its nice if you can clutch and shift it easily when moving. So since its easy to access with everything out and sitting on the floor, decided to pull apart the housing and shift hub assembly (the other half - the planetary hub, and various gear inside the bowl gear are still attached to the trans output shaft inside the TC housing...
Here are some pics - with the collar shifted all the way down (or rearward) which puts it in OD:


with the collar all the way up (or forward) which would also then slide over the splines on the end of the planetary hub and locks it into direct:


It really has a 'chunky' shift and the collar likes to get 'stuck' about halfway between the two positions - its not super noticeable when driving and using the shifter cane, but getting the collar to slide between positions by hand pulling/pushing on the shift rail is very difficult. I cleaned up some gunky oily residue on everything and its slides better, but the issue is still what I assume is gear clash/synchro issue between the sun gear and the planetary gears. Just to make sure its not the shift rail binding or sticking, I pulled the poppet ball and cleaned up the shift rail some.

Got it mostly disassembled:


Starting from the inside, here is the shift hub - that shiny wear looking ring is from me - forgot how soft aluminum is. Also, notice the small little post thingy sticking out around 2 oclock - I assume that is for the blocking ring and keeps it floating and positioned correctly when the shift collar is on the other side? There is not one on the opposite end of the hub:


The hub slides into the 'stationary drive' at the rear of the unit like this with a bronze blocking ring in between:


So that outer sleeve surface of the hub has some minor machine grooves for oiling I assume - they seem reasonably fine?


The rear blocking ring sits on the outer cone of the stationary drive, and the inside of that cone/sleeve also has nicely machined grooves for the end of the hub assembly...


The one part of that I am not loving entirely....the outer cone surface of the stationary drive that the blocking ring sits on doesn't look as pristine as I would like.... maybe the ring was binding on the cone?:


And here is the inside of the blocking ring that rides on that cone - the grooves are for oiling and keeping the ring free to turn on the cone:


Here is the shift collar - it seems fine to me:



Here are the 3 dogs and springs - also look fine to me:

[FINOCJ]

The other end of the main shaft has the small sun gear (which goes inside a set of 4 planetary gears to allow for the OD function).....that end rides on an old school contained set of needle bearings....some play in that, but no super concerning:


The shift fork looks very good...slight shiny polish on the pads.



the rear bearing is in really good shape....smooth and solid


Here is the front cone which is the rear nose of the planetary assembly - the mainshaft slides inside this planetary assembly which is mounted on the trans ouput shaft and is contained inside the transfer case housing (gotta love an old school D18) - it could use a bit of emery cloth polishing as well, but doesn't have any of the (heat?) discoloration the rear cone has above:


The OD wasnt even installed on the wagon initially, it's been on for 3-4k miles. Oil is equally as fresh Stalube gl4. My stuff was assembled with Vaseline....the OD was essentially dry when I got it. It was a salvaged unit from an ecj5 member....it's history is unknown. Most of the pieces have a gunky dark film of either separated oil or assembly grease from prior use and/or sitting in a junk jeep for years - but my oil that came out is fresh and clean. I did not disassemble and clean prior to installing - wouldn't be surprising if it's cleaning itself out a bit. I gambled and figured just go with it and see what happens....it runs totally fine and quiet in either gear - just doesn't like shifting down when moving. If I hadn't pulled it out with the engine, I wouldn't have taken it out. Guessing the rear blocking ring is binding on the stationary cone....as a friend described it, the stuck blocking ring will keep power on the synchro assembly while in neutral. it just grinds when you try to shift to any other gear like the clutch is not pressed down - this is pretty much exactly how it feels when your try to downshift it when driving. I can either try some emery cloth on the cone, or buy a new stationary member. Also thinking a couple new blocking rings, and I think it should be good to go....oh and a bunch of new gaskets