Revamped 77F150 Build Thread

[Fordguy77]

I am finally getting around to rebuilding the 77. Literally 2 years after joining the Frontrange, and making its original build thread. I was going over the original an noticed that its far off topic now and has mixed builds of the Ol B2 project we had to scrap and even some of the ranger. So I decided that it would be best for me to redo its whole build thread, and hope one of the mods can lock out or delete the old thread as a whole. The overall Build hasn't changed, and is more of a restro than a 4x4 monster. However it will be sometime before i am able to do a real restro, so it will be getting some mods to make it more trail friendly for the time being.
Basic Outlines

Engine-
100% Rebuild from the ground up
New KB Pistons which will raise my compression from 8.4 Up to around 9.4-9.7ish. With the exception of the cam, this is probably one of the largest single improvements i can make to gain more power.
RV Based Cam
Edelbrock Intake
And a set of headers(I have some off my donor rig but they are long tube headers, and kinda defy the concept of ground clearance.)
600-650CFM Carb sitting up top. Right now i have a holley 750 and an edel 750 but imo they are just too much for what i need.
I also plan on reinstalling the AC at some point. Not anytime soon, but i would like to as this truck came with factory AC and has all the goods for it.

Drive-train
I have already rebuild the D44 Front and its solid and good to go for now.
The 9in out back needs a new gasket around the 3d member but other than that its good to go.
My 205NP was rebuilt around 500 miles ago, however it seems like shes weeping out the output shaft seal.
I also plan on running a twin stick for the 205 just for fun.
And the big one
I am swapping out the C6 in favor for a NP435. For several reasons. First and foremost, for whatever reason C6s and I just don't mix. Second I like Manuals Better. The gearing in the NP435 has better suited gearing for offraod purposes, however there are some significant gaps between gears, the Motor is more than capable of making up for, and they don't seem all that noticeable from the ones i have driven.
The Gearing For Comparison is as Follows
Gear C6 NP435
1st 2.46:1 6.68:1
2nd 1.46:1 3.34:1
3rd 1:1 1.74:1
4th n/a 1:1
Rev 2.20:1 8.26:1
The only major drawback i can think of so far, is no hydraulic clutch :erm:
The good news is i have every component needed for the swap already as i am going to part with my 79 bronco, and use it as a donor. It came from Illinois, and has the rust to prove it.

Interior
I eventually plan on re-carpeting it, and restoring it to new. But for now if i can find a seat cover to fit the bench that should do fine. I am going to swap my steering column over from the bronco into the F150 so it will look as if it came with the 4spd and not the C6. I also need to replace the headliner, and find a spot for a cb at one point.

Exterior Mods
FLATBED!!!! Well itll just look nice and add some much need ground clearance for that half of the rig. I have in the Area of a 133" wheel base, so no bed sides would be a nice thing. Im also going to dove tail the flat bed Somewhere around the center of the axle line or just behind it.
Sliders are a must as to not kill my Rockers/Doors as i do wish to restore it.
And if i get around to a nice front winch bumper.
And i need to get the drivers door painted to match the rest of the truck.

The main goal is to have it back on the trails by Christmas, so some of this stuff will be waiting for a while.
Here are a few pics of it during its life. On a side note is has BFG MTRS on it now and not the **** tires shown in the pictures.

[Fordguy77]

I started pulling some stuff out of the engine compartment today. As well as removed both the drive-shafts. Just waiting for my dad to get home to help me get the monster of a 205NP out. Cast iron + Gear Driven= Stupid Heavy. I tried Using the transmission jack, but it doesn't go high enough and i don't feel good about how its sitting on it.
Pics of the engine compartment, and some of the donor's motor.

[Rob]

So I decided that it would be best for me to redo its whole build thread, and hope one of the mods can lock out or delete the old thread as a whole.

Done, with a link to this thread.

[scout man]

i love that truck man. When you get this thing running we'll have to take a drive with that and my 76. Mine isnt in near as nice physical condition though.

[Michael4rnr]

Awesome truck, my dad has a 77 f250 and we love it.

[Brody]

600-650CFM Carb sitting up top. Right now i have a holley 750 and an edel 750 but imo they are just too much for what i need.
I also plan on reinstalling the AC at some point. Not anytime soon, but i would like to as this truck came with factory AC and has all the goods for it.

PM Chris (the younger) as he has a carb he is going to get rid of on his CJ when he goes to a Howell EFI and get the number off that carb. It may every well not work as my guess is that is it also a 750 and also way too much carb. Worth a shot.

Most of my 4xs have been carbed and the single biggest problem I had with the carbs was 'too much' carb. You simply don't need it. This is the biggest problem with Chris' Frank. As an aside, all of the 4xs I had with carbs, I got to work just fine, once I got it into my head that I was either going to have a wheeling 4x4 or a mall crawler 4x4.

[Clint Z]

The sad thing with Holley carbs are that if you could cut the back half off the 750 cfm, you would be just about perfect!

They always seem to run rich.

[Fordguy77]

The sad thing with Holley carbs are that if you could cut the back half off the 750 cfm, you would be just about perfect!

They always seem to run rich.


I can check and see what it is for sure, but I know it's big! Pumps way to much for the Jeep!

Yeah, i have noticed with my holly no matter how much i adjust my mixture it always either seems lean to the point where it doesn't wanna run right, or just a little too rich. I will say i have had better luck and like my holleys a hell of a lot more than the edelbrocks.
That would be cool chris! let me know, but your probably in the 700CFM range like i am, because people think bigger is simply better in most cases and over carb.

[Clint Z]

BTW, what were the old tires?

[Fordguy77]

BTW, what were the old tires?

Peerless Force 4s 33x12.5R15s

Sent from my T-Mobile myTouch 3G Slide using Tapatalk

[Clint Z]

do you still have them? i am looking for some spares for the suburban I worked on.

Thanks,

Clint

[Fordguy77]

do you still have them? i am looking for some spares for the suburban I worked on.

Thanks,

Clint
No, they have long since been disposed of. Sorry.

[Clint Z]

Not a problem, Scrat is hooking me up.

I will need to borrow the engine lift sometime.

Later, Clint

[Hypoid]

I want to go the opposite direction with my '74. If it were an auto tranny, my Mrs could drive it...if she had too. :rolleyes:

Let me know if you decide to get rid of the steering column, linkages, and pedal assembly for the auto tranny. I might have a 600 CFM builder carb of the 1860 flavor.

[Heather]

Very cool, Chris. I like the yellow one in the background, too - reminds me of my grandpa's truck! Can't wait till you're wheeling again!

[Popsgarage]

Chris and Chris, I've got a couple of 600's sitting in the garage that you guys can have. They'll need rebuilt, but they might just work for ya!

[Cr33p3r]

Chris is that the 351M or 400M engine? On the Fords at this altitude I have found the Edelbrocks work best, once you have them dialed in you basically don't have to fart with them again unlike the Holleys always needing adjusted due to Barametric changes and the like.
If you want a Edelbrock that will work great on either of those motors or even the small blocks this one is a good to go with;

Edelbrock Carburetor - Part Number: 4506-03133034
Performer Series - 600cfm - Square-Flange - Electric Choke - w / o EGR - Includes Primary Jet-0.098 - Sec. Jet-0.095 - Metering Rod-0.075x0.047 - Dual Plane Intake - New - Endurashine
Features:
Both Timed and Full Vacuum Ports
Burnished Aluminum
Easy Tuning with 2-Piece Design
Electric Choke Installed from Factory
GM/AMC-Style Throttle Linkage
Includes PCV Outlet
Smooth Secondary Transition

And if you want the one for EGR I will have to do more research to find the info on it. Also it is nothing to change these over to manual chokes if you want to go that route too. Only other thing I could say is if you go to one of these DEFINITELY get the tune kit too! You'll be happy you did!

[Brody]

Are you talking about a 'street' carb or 'off road' carb, Sean? Really easy to set up a 'street' carb. Not so easy to set up one for off road so that it works well. Sure, you can set the needles and seat to work on a level surface to perform well, but you enter an entirely different ball game setting them up so that they work well for off road. Usually, a much smaller carb works best for off road, and many times a two barrel works way better than a 4 barrel because you simply do not need all that much gas for wheeling.

There are also a lot of other things to keep in mind when you run a carb off road. You will need different needles and seats, as well as different metering rods, different springs, will probably need to block off the connecting port, add a fuel pressure regulator, and do some fine tuning on the floats. I don't know how much experience you have with carbs and wheeling, but I have spent a lot of time trying to get carbs in almost all of the 4x4s I have had, probably 90% of them with carbs, tuned to the point where they actually work well when I went off road. Street tuning is a piece of cake in comparison. Bigger isn't necessarily better, either, and what works for the street, certainly doesn't work off road.

Sure, some of that depends a lot on what kind of "wheeling" you want to do. If "wheeling" is going to consist of driving on relatively level, but bumpy trails and passes, you aren't going to have to do much more than adjust the carb for altitude and call it good. If you are going to get into harder trails where you are going to be very off camber, driving over rocks, be at relatively extreme angles or all of those at the same time, you had best install an off road "kit" and be prepared to spend a fair amount of time dicking with the carb to get it right. In fact, you will find that you will establish a rather intimate relationship with any carbed 4x4 before it is actually dialed in.

Even with the huge amount of information available on the internet and from the manufacturers about dialing in a carb for off road use, the more research you do on it, the better off you are going to be.

Luckily there is a slew of information on the internet about tuning up almost all the major brands of carbs for off road. Almost all of the big name carb companies offer an "off road kit" for their carbs to address the issues, too.

[Clint Z]

Jonathan, if they don't need them, i will take one or both, i need to swap a 351w from FI to carb for my swap.

thanks,

Clint

[Popsgarage]

Will bring 'em over to Pete's along with the axles as long as that's OK with Pete.

[Brody]

OK by me...Just label them so I know what (or who) goes to who (or what) in case I am not home. I get confused easily...

If there is an extra 600 after the end of all this, I want to grab one for Scrat in case we have to choose between the Howell EFI and getting it on the trail....

[Popsgarage]

Let me check. I think I've got 3. For Chris, just get the adapter plate from Howell and get the harness, computer and throttle body from the junkyard. Just about the same displacement and cam spec. Should run just fine. And if it doesn't, you're not out but maybe $75 or $100.

[Cr33p3r]

The Edelbrocks fair pretty well offroad once they are tuned for the altitude they have side bowls rather than front to rear and when on an angle whether it be front to rear or side to side they still feed fuel much better than the another carburetor that I won't name.

[Brody]

they still feed fuel much better than the another carburetor that I won't name.

****'s wrong with naming the carb? None of the carbs, no matter who the **** makes 'em are going to do as well off road as EFI, and everyone knows that. Don't think anybody really cares too much, either. Name away... It's like the Chevy/Ford/Dodge/Rice burner bs...every one has an opinion as what works better/best, they all hate the other makes and they all can be made to work. I have had Holleys, Carters, Motorcrafts, Edelbrocks, Q Jets, Weber, Aisen and just about every other make of carbs on various 4x4s and managed to get them ALL to work just fine. Did I love any particular one? No. Do I think EFI is better? Yes.

Did I have to play around or install different needle, seat, springs, metering rods and adjust the float is all of the carbs to get them to work? You bet your ass I did.

Chris just found that he has a huge old timer's resource as far as adjusting carbs for off road that he is going to take full advantage of. Chris the younger will benefit from that as well if he has the opportunity. This is good since my last carb R&R for off road was late 80s or very early 90s, at least with non Aisen stuff. I can do it still, I imagine, just have to dust off some brain cells.

[Fordguy77]

So once again i am going to attempt to revive this thread, and see if i cant actually make forward progress on one of my vehicles, even though this and the ranger have been standing still for what seems to be an eternity.
But the last few days i actually managed to get started on this animal, well at least started the plan of attack. And in good taste i started my engine removal process off right, by pulling the interior out first :smokin:
This Morning
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-f8rFRvUy7yM/UOxvtgopPFI/AAAAAAAAAfA/yh52y-5UO4I/s912/IMAG0084.jpg
And as of right now
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-NhLOQx8gq8U/UOx-HIs53UI/AAAAAAAAAg4/yNYepfXZx_g/s640/DSC00024.JPG

[Jim]

Auto trans selector on the column and xfer case shifter on the floor?

[Fordguy77]

Auto trans selector on the column and xfer case shifter on the floor?
Yeah, that's how most of the older trucks are all set up. Im removing the auto 100%, and installing a NP435 4spd in its place. The gearing should help wake up the truck, as well as a fresh motor.

[Fordguy77]

Managed to get a little further on the 77, got these 2 bad boys on the ground, and some minor engine buy stuff.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-qObEe0hsIVI/UOzLlxmg0aI/AAAAAAAAAik/pCGpB_jmfqM/s720/DSC00026.JPG


https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-40pHngmovdY/UOx3ciV-HtI/AAAAAAAAAgc/G7LE3XrhFhI/s912/IMAG0094.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Hcd-TTwe3gU/UOzLmlc_EXI/AAAAAAAAAis/sEnz8APInKs/s720/DSC00025.JPG

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-HtoqTEgeqEA/UOzLk8FbjrI/AAAAAAAAAig/4zcHZWqFcFo/s720/DSC00027.JPG

[Popsgarage]

Lookin' good.

[Fordguy77]

Lookin' good.
Thanks Pops! It feels great to be wrenching on a rig again, i can believe how much ive missed it.

[Fordguy77]

Well today, i was lucky enough to resume progress and get after the motor finally. I ended up pulling the motor alone so it took about a 30 hour once everything was set up, but overall it didn't go to bad. i had to remove both tires, and drop the front of the truck until the rotors were less than a 1/2 of an inch from hitting the ground. To do this i simply used two floor jacks, one under each radius arm. Unbolted the motor-mounts, and pulled her out, the crazy part is even with the front end dropped that low, the motor only cleared the radiator support by about 1/2"! And as you can tell from the pictures space is something im lacking and that doesn't seem to help my cause any. Once i finally got the engine put on a stand i began dismantling it. Found a large amount of metal shavings in the oil pan, and then some more in the oil pump pick up. The culprit turned out to be the #1 rod bearing, its so bad that 99% of the bearing is in the pan, and the other 1% is in the pickup. The #1 journal has some gouging, hopefully the crank is still salvageable. Well im not feeling too well, so ill get the pictures.
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-RX84EOQZLxA/UO4qqiNA4dI/AAAAAAAAAmo/Kp6FFm6wKJ0/s640/DSC00028.JPG
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-nIqyt7-MhtE/UO4qrfOet-I/AAAAAAAAAms/0tKSaoh-rKU/s640/DSC00029.JPG
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-L8D_su8e8xc/UO4qrw-51jI/AAAAAAAAAmw/imEpWzc1CGw/s640/DSC00030.JPG
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-f2Y81x3Uv3g/UO4qxe7KtHI/AAAAAAAAAnA/ukP0nOTktf0/s640/DSC00031.JPG
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-sflx6EZcKs0/UO4qzDpBkwI/AAAAAAAAAnM/G6T9ongawiM/s640/DSC00032.JPG
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Jo0XP8ozNV0/UO4q0bLqfxI/AAAAAAAAAnQ/xLD3lEDQa0c/s640/DSC00033.JPG

[Fordguy77]

More Pics
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-5MPlBlU6DX8/UO4q5QEi3zI/AAAAAAAAAng/_XbFkUM77Kk/s640/DSC00034.JPG
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-VT5kx5u8LsM/UO4q6g1f_KI/AAAAAAAAAnk/AVTpzgwPUew/s640/DSC00035.JPG
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-5Y2UWfcROXw/UO4q7CCwKgI/AAAAAAAAAns/H_p_aEmR728/s640/DSC00036.JPG
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-awgw4RLhNaA/UO4rAbIjZeI/AAAAAAAAAn8/8b9AGzmnpro/s640/DSC00037.JPG
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-BfI89iKYO7Q/UO4rCGzVO_I/AAAAAAAAAoI/vqeX_h8eq1U/s640/DSC00038.JPG
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-QNwLZZP8L5Y/UO4rBzW6RGI/AAAAAAAAAoA/OO_5-3mZMiI/s640/DSC00039.JPG

[Fordguy77]

More Pics
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-OE5knwvMf4s/UO4rHio_AOI/AAAAAAAAAoU/uhJBmvcMIDo/s512/DSC00040.JPG
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-DSkGeq6xOK4/UO4rjryMPVI/AAAAAAAAAog/Q9HkUrPWZfY/s912/IMAG0096.jpg
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-v9Rb1FvJsAc/UO4rl2-aoqI/AAAAAAAAAow/xlKAg278GF4/s912/IMAG0097.jpg
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-coc5SuVWl9M/UO4qXpA2_kI/AAAAAAAAAmc/f5KW1qwnNBg/s512/20130109_170302.jpg
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/--6YmAevQx0c/UO4qXvBSVjI/AAAAAAAAAmY/WP6BDUKAW8o/s640/20130109_170329.jpg

And the last pic, is of the 400 short block, haning out next to a complete 460.
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-2BGyG2L_rtw/UO4rnKiNr8I/AAAAAAAAAo4/oy-8DHdAzkU/s912/IMAG0099.jpg

[Coonburger]

i got some conversion mounts to a 460 if u want em . there just chlling in my garage, one set is a solid type and the others i beleive are conversion rubber type. one set i was planning doing the same swap never got around to it , other set came with a f150 i had for a little bit. if u need em come get em there just collecting dust in my garage.

[Fordguy77]

i got some conversion mounts to a 460 if u want em . there just chlling in my garage, one set is a solid type and the others i beleive are conversion rubber type. one set i was planning doing the same swap never got around to it , other set came with a f150 i had for a little bit. if u need em come get em there just collecting dust in my garage.
Thanks for the offer, however after a lot of research over the last few years I'm sticking with my 400. For the same amount of money just in the engine rebuild they come out the same power wise, and the 400 is still a significant amount lighter, and then I don't have to worry about fit it issues or conversions.

[The StRanger]

With a good RV cam & 0 deg timing chain
Makes damn good power..

[Fordguy77]

With a good RV cam & 0 deg timing chain
Makes damn good power..
Thats my plan! And is good to hear, i have read good things about the 400 from the people who have actually taken the time to mess with them, however when i talked to my grandpa and some of his friends they told me i was just playing with a boat anchor. Im also planning on changing out pistons to up my compression to 9.4 from the stock 8.1 or whatever it was. And i have a set of headers off of my donor rig, and am going with a 2.5" dual exhaust with cross over.
Does this sound reasonable to you Sam? From your post it sounds like you've been around this block a time or two. This is my first solo V8 build, so im a little nervous about my plan of attack.

[The StRanger]

Thats my plan! And is good to hear, i have read good things about the 400 from the people who have actually taken the time to mess with them, however when i talked to my grandpa and some of his friends they told me i was just playing with a boat anchor. Im also planning on changing out pistons to up my compression to 9.4 from the stock 8.1 or whatever it was. And i have a set of headers off of my donor rig, and am going with a 2.5" dual exhaust with cross over.
Does this sound reasonable to you Sam? From your post it sounds like you've been around this block a time or two. This is my first solo V8 build, so im a little nervous about my plan of attack.

Bigest thing is the chain, Ford chain was retarded 3 degs for emisions
If you run eather 0 deg or poss 1 deg pos realy wakes up the engine

[The StRanger]

i talked to my grandpa and some of his friends they told me i was just playing with a boat anchor.
.

Some power head dont like the 351M, 400 Because of no aftermarket backing.
What works on one engine, works on most engines
You just cant run to Summit and pay for power ..

[scout man]

I thought that engine looked small coming out! I think mine has the 460 in it though, so thats why it looked that way to me! Fortunately the last owner went through all that effort, and the thing runs like a dream! Well, except I think it drinks way more gas than even that beast should.

[AccordRanger]

Looking good Chris! I need to start working on my Chevy, I miss having a big truck to drive around.

[Coonburger]

well dove c heads .30 over , edlebrock performer intake , cam, flat tops and ur talking over 300 horse cheap and easy. it'll stomp that 400 any day of the week. Cant bore 400's more than about .40 over cuz of thin castings. i loved my 400. but looking for power. build a 460 alot cheaper and get alot more horsepower for your price. here is a build a link to 460ford.com kinda gives ya idea what you can build with that 460. http://www.460ford.com/forum/showthread.php?t=119213. The swap is pretty easy actually, conversion mounts. If i remember right Fender well exit headers or notching the frame is what'll you have to do for exhaust. other than that make sure u got a thick radiator. make sure tranny bolts up done. I have done a couple but its been a long time since ive played with those old fords.

[Coonburger]

oh yeah oiling issues with the 400's some claim its a myth but its a plain fact. here is a link u may want to check out telling you how to fix it so u that motor lasts you longer. http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/351m-oiling-problems-3278.html

[Fordguy77]

well dove c heads .30 over , edlebrock performer intake , cam, flat tops and ur talking over 300 horse cheap and easy. it'll stomp that 400 any day of the week. Cant bore 400's more than about .40 over cuz of thin castings. i loved my 400. but looking for power. build a 460 alot cheaper and get alot more horsepower for your price. here is a build a link to 460ford.com kinda gives ya idea what you can build with that 460. http://www.460ford.com/forum/showthread.php?t=119213. The swap is pretty easy actually, conversion mounts. If i remember right Fender well exit headers or notching the frame is what'll you have to do for exhaust. other than that make sure u got a thick radiator. make sure tranny bolts up done. I have done a couple but its been a long time since ive played with those old fords.
Thank you for the input, but for my $ to power ratio i will still be sticking with my 400. For the price of a rebuild on my 400, and the few mods i need to make to be in the 300s, it is still far cheaper than attempting the 460 swap.

Im by no means saying the 400 is a better motor than a 460, however for my use the 400 is the better choice. The 460 has all the aftermarket support in the world, however it does have its down falls as well. As far as the boring of the motor, with the exception of early cast 460, they actually cant be bored out any further than a 400 and still maintain proper heating and cooling properties, as well as retain reliability. The main draw back of the 400 is the lack of after market support, otherwise its a secret contender. As you mentioned the 400s did have an occasional problem with proper oiling, and it lead to premature bearing failure., however a simple restricter plug in the #2 oiling galley seems to take care of this, and remove the issue entirely. Also the 400 is a dog of a motor, but from my personal experiences still yield better fuel economy than the 460, not that it really matters in these old trucks.

For the 460 to fit in these trucks, you have to do one of 2 things as you said. Im against notching the frame, as all you are doing is creating a weak point in the frame, rather close to your radius arm mounts. So why induce more fatigue in an area of the frame that is already subjected to stress. The other option to go out the fender-well isn't so bad, with the exception if you want to run sliders to the frame they can cause huge interference issues there, as well as I've noticed most exhausts run in those locations hang unusually low.

If you preform a stock 400 to stock 460 swap, you actually aren't gaining any significant amount of power. There is only a 20 horse difference, and the 460 has a higher stock compression ratio than the 400.

If you start factoring the cost to build the 460, ie getting the dove heads, new intake, headers, conversion mounts, correcting the power steering system, a larger radiator, fuel pump, and everything you need to make it up to 300 horse adds up pretty quick.

On the 400 you already have everything you need, no conversions or special parts required, no issues with exhaust interference, no significant upgrades to the cooling system, you start to come out money ahead. And with the same parts you listed for the 460, purchased similarly for the 400, you end up in the same range of power, money ahead, and fewer headaches.

Also when it comes to suspension, unless you start messing with aluminum heads(starting to shell out real $$$) the 460 is significantly heavier. And your normal 4" lift springs only yield near 2.5" of lift due to the weight increase.

Because of all the above, and my own stubbornness, im going to continue swearing by the 400s in these old trucks before i see a 460 swap in one.

[Fordguy77]

Looking good Chris! I need to start working on my Chevy, I miss having a big truck to drive around.
Thanks Shayne, I know the feeling, one of the reasons im hitting the 77 so hot and heavy. Other than i miss being out on the trail, and having some ponies to play with. I love my FJ, but its underpowered to the point where its just no fun.

[CS79bronco]

There's actually quite a bit of after market support for the 400. Tim Meyer has a lot of parts available, and there are other sources too.

[AccordRanger]

Thanks Shayne, I know the feeling, one of the reasons im hitting the 77 so hot and heavy. Other than i miss being out on the trail, and having some ponies to play with. I love my FJ, but its underpowered to the point where its just no fun.

I feel ya there. The explorer feels so slow with the tires on it compared to my moms sport.

[Fordguy77]

I feel ya there. The explorer feels so slow with the tires on it compared to my moms sport.
Time for gears? Or better yet a supercharger!

[The StRanger]

Time for gears? Or better yet a supercharger!

Or just regear the diffs !

[The StRanger]

There's actually quite a bit of after market support for the 400. Tim Meyer has a lot of parts available, and there are other sources too.

440's, 351 M's & 351c'suare all the same base
Lots of stuff will swap...

[Coonburger]

yeah i loved my 400 it was a stump pulling son of a gun. just didnt know where u were planning on going. sorry if i came off wrong or something just wanted to make sure u had all the info as i have alot of experiance with these old fords. i actually miss em :(. with my 400 that was about 270 ish horse. i did lockers front and rear with 456 gears. and 35 inch boggers. It spun them really well just had issues with breaking stub shafts on the dana 44. Also had a bad tendancy to break the cheaper lockouts only ones it wouldnt break was warn premiums. Got really good with switching them and the axle shafts out used to be able to do it in like 20 min. god i miss that truck. wanna trade lol . the red was one of my favs though also that was definately the one i learned how to work on em.
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/15133_101110206580154_2818074_n.jpghttp://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/603247_535386979819139_1242420882_n.jpg

[Fordguy77]

yeah i loved my 400 it was a stump pulling son of a gun. just didnt know where u were planning on going. sorry if i came off wrong or something just wanted to make sure u had all the info as i have alot of experiance with these old fords. i actually miss em :(. with my 400 that was about 270 ish horse. i did lockers front and rear with 456 gears. and 35 inch boggers. It spun them really well just had issues with breaking stub shafts on the dana 44. Also had a bad tendancy to break the cheaper lockouts only ones it wouldnt break was warn premiums. Got really good with switching them and the axle shafts out used to be able to do it in like 20 min. god i miss that truck. wanna trade lol . the red was one of my favs though also that was definately the one i learned how to work on em.
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/15133_101110206580154_2818074_n.jpghttp://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/603247_535386979819139_1242420882_n.jpg
No worries! Sorry if I sounded defensive, just been gettin a lot of grief from friends and old timers about wanting to stay with my 400. Those are some nice looking olf fords you had!

[AccordRanger]

Time for gears? Or better yet a supercharger!

I want to swap in the 5.0.

[Fordguy77]

I want to swap in the 5.0. After going throu all the effort of the rebuild "hipo" 4.0L. I did, looking back it'd of been cheaper and better power gains going with the 5.0. Its a good motor.

[Fordguy77]

Just ran into a huge wall with this build. Due to the availability of my desired pistons, I cant build the motor the way I have intended until march. And due to time restrictions with the up coming work season, compromises may have to be made somewhere, and i'll have to wait to have my high performance build completed.
Current Options Include

1. Stock Compression Rebuild, almost 100HP difference

2. Re-Ring my running 351M from the donor truck

3. Re-ring the 351m, and wait for the parts for the 400 to come in, so i can build the 400 the way i want.

The downfall to this is i am working with an unknown amount of time, due to my career. In all reality I could be called tonight to go to work in California tomorrow, with no notice.

Any thoughts?

[scout man]

my thought, as unpopular as it may seem to you. Do you what you have to do to get a good, functional engine in that thing and go have some fun with it!!!

[Fordguy77]

my thought, as unpopular as it may seem to you. Do you what you have to do to get a good, functional engine in that thing and go have some fun with it!!!
I hear you Steve, im leaning towards jut re-ringing my 351m, and running that for now, and waiting to finish my 400 later.

[The StRanger]

my thought, as unpopular as it may seem to you. Do you what you have to do to get a good, functional engine in that thing and go have some fun with it!!!

As long as its running you can have time to play with the big engine..
And that way theres no rush...

[Fordguy77]

After talking to my machinist some more this afternoon, and hearing from a few people on some other forums, and about 6 hours of googling, i have came to a solution! I am going to end up using pistons out of a 351C with some reworking to the wrist pin area. I am either going to have to bore out the pin hole on the piston, or bush the rod end. Theres a .067 thous difference between pin sizes. Either way this will still let me use a high compression ratio piston, and get my motor built with out to many more delays.

[Fordguy77]

The motors been at the shop for a few days now, and they are just getting to dismantling the short block i brought them. So far 1 rod is for sure toast, as well as the crank, helpfully that's all the carnage i incurred.
Picture Coming Soon.

[Fordguy77]

Bent Rod, and Smashed Piston
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-zqcRWGqVS9I/UQDNzX0LHJI/AAAAAAAAApY/i0cEBRtFGwA/s800/download.jpg

[scout man]

Sexy

[The StRanger]

Bent Rod, and Smashed Piston
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-zqcRWGqVS9I/UQDNzX0LHJI/AAAAAAAAApY/i0cEBRtFGwA/s800/download.jpg

OUCH !!!!!

[Fordguy77]

Parts have finally come, but of course i am out of town and cant do anything with them, let alone get a pic. Hopefully katey can get them dropped off to the machine shop okay on thursday, and hopefully start to see this build moving forward.

[Fordguy77]

Just picked this up a few days ago. The 77 shall rise again soon I hope.

[Popsgarage]

Nice. Here's to hoping it runs as well as you hope! The one part of an engine build that always makes me nervous, getting it done, installed and firing it up for the first time.

[Cr33p3r]

Nice looking engine Chris hoping it runs great let me know if you want a hand putting it back in.

[Fordguy77]

Nice looking engine Chris hoping it runs great let me know if you want a hand putting it back in.
Thanks for the offer Sean! Probably wont need any help with install, but may be in need of assistance in the fine tuning of the carb. May be shopping for a new one, just not sure where I'll end up yet.

[Cr33p3r]

Ok just let me know, which carb do you have for it now?

[Fordguy77]

Ok just let me know, which carb do you have for it now?
Not sure of the model. It it's an Edlebrock 750 4barrel. Personally a 750 seems rather large and a 650 seems like a better fit. But sadly I've grown up in the days EFI, so my carb knowledge is basic, rebuilds and adjusting idle is about all I know.

[Cr33p3r]

Edelbrocks are one of the simplest to work on just a matter of taking time to fine tune them and they work great is what I have experienced so far. There was a 650 on CL friday for like $125

[Hypoid]

Did you ever look up the specs for the stock carb?

[Fordguy77]

Did you ever look up the specs for the stock carb?
No i haven't. Granted I know mine was a 2 barrel from the factory. However my new motor is far from stock, compression was bumped from 8.5:1 to 9.75:1 bored .060 over(sadly had no other choice) rv cam, ported and polished heads, performer intake, headers, fully balanced, line bored mains. So she may consume a bit more than stock.

[Fordguy77]

Was cleaning out the garage today and found another edlebrock. It's a 600cfm model I believe.

[Fordguy77]

After hanging out with my dad, and much discussion I came to a realization. And no its not that i have to many cars. It is that my 77 F150 is actually the closest thing I have to being done enough to go play again. So I bit the bullet and put my tax refund to work, and ordered the last foreseeable stuff I could think of, as well as a few optional upgrades. Sadly I am not going to be able to run my stock valve covers, as they have almost no clearance on the rockers, and more so because they are warped and look like the ocean.
Parts Coming Soon-

DUI Distributor with internal coil and module wrapped in blue
Taylor Made 8.2mm ThunderVolt spark plug wires
Hi Flow Summit Racing water pump
Tall Ford Racing Valve Covers


Thats about it for the high ticket items.

Other misc stuff-

Spark Plugs- Copper Motorcraft, super cheap and probably one of the best plugs made.
PCV Valve
Upper/lower Radiator hoses
EGR valve
Oil Pressure sender
Water temp sender
180 Degree thermostat
Motor Mounts
Starter Soleniod


I was looking at rebuilding my 1G alternator and upping it to 100amps, but have found some great info on swapping in a 3G 130 Amp out of a Ford Taurus. So I ordered a conversion pig tail $20 to save me the headache of having to splice the wires myself. The only down side to this is that the 3G alternators have an internal voltage regulator vs the old style external. Makes it a little more costly to repair, and not nearly as easy. But I am not going to miss carrying around a spare voltage regulator.

I plan on running the mechanical fan for now, but would like to add a secondary electric fan. My motor was bored .060 over so I am slightly worried about keeping it cool. However my machine shop has repeatably told me that I will be fine and my water jackets still have plenty of meat left on them. That is also why I choose to upgrade to a high volume water pump. I am thinking about going with the Taurus Fan Upgrade, and just wiring them in on a switch, seeing as I am already going to be robbing a Taurus for an alternator.

I am also converting my truck from a C6 automatic to a 4spd NP435. I have a complete donor rig to pull everything off of so it should go fairly smooth. I am even swapping out steering columns to give my truck the appearance of having always been a 4spd. I also plan on swapping my steering setup from my 79 Donor to my 77 as it has a better steering geometry and is a direct swap.

Outside of all of this I am planning on adding dual battery's and a winch and lights at some point possible. I just plan on using a RuffStuff battery box, and following the DIY battery isolator write up I found over on expedition portal.

Down the road I am planning on 35s and rebuilding my 9" and HP Dana 44, I was thinking about just rebuilding the set under my donor rig, then swapping them out one weekend. Also was going to put a set of sliders on, as this rig will hopefully one day get the cosmetic portion of a restoration rather than just the mechanical.

Junkyard List-



130 Amp Ford Taurus Alternator
Taurus Dual Fans


Today I did manage to complete the rebuild on my carb. Surprisingly it didn't look to bad on the inside. No varnish and everything was fairly clean. Did have some sand/dirt in the fuel bowls but aside from that she wasn't to bad. I cleaned up my timing chain cover and was able to get it painted. Hopefully I get over to my grandparents sometime soon and can pick up my seal driver set, so i can drive the old seal out, and get the new one in. After that just need to get the oil pump installed and I can throw the pan on. After that I can finish masking off the valves and a few other areas, and paint the block. Once shes painted I can start bolting everything on. I plan to drop the motor in 90% complete to save some time. I thought about trying to put the motor in with the transmission already mated up. However I had such little room pulling the motor, the thought of adding the transmission seemed like a bad idea sadly. As I am not looking forward to trying to pick up the NP435 cast iron beast. I also started compiling a pile of parts that need to hit the sand blaster.



Hood Springs
Alternator/Power Steering Brackets
Water Pump Pulley
Crank Pulley
Power Steering Pulley
Motor Mounts

[CS79bronco]

Chris, drop your motor in & block it up after you get the mounts bolted. Then use your engine hoist & a strap, reach inside the cab with the hoist & lift the tranny into place with the big access plate out. IIRC you can lift the NP435 & 205 together, or at least get them up where they are much easier to get into place than bench pressing them.
I am guessing that you are going to use the steering from the Bronco, which will give you a shorter turning radius if you use the Bronco D44. Then you would have a high pinion, isn't the F150 D44 a low pinion? And the Bronco 9" should be 35 spline axles vs 31 splines in the 150 (I think).

[Cr33p3r]

Was cleaning out the garage today and found another edlebrock. It's a 600cfm model I believe.

Yes that is the electric choke model 600 CFM (1406) if you tune this one use the chart for the 1405 it is more accurate for tuning than the 1406 chart at this altitude and if you have trouble using the 1406chart to get it setup. I got lucky and was able to go with the 1406 chart and it is running good.

[Hypoid]

Then you would have a high pinion, isn't the F150 D44 a low pinion? And the Bronco 9" should be 35 spline axles vs 31 splines in the 150 (I think).IIRC, both should have HP D-44s and 31 spline rear axle shafts.

[Fordguy77]

IIRC, both should have HP D-44s and 31 spline rear axle shafts.
To my knowledge this is true. My 77 currently has a HP44 and every 73-79 1/2 ton I've seen runs a HP44. I do know that there were a few housing differences in the later years. As well as they had 3 different steering geometries, and the 78-79 was the best/simplest.

[Fordguy77]

The new dizzy, wires and water pump came in last night.

[The StRanger]

Uwwwwwww !!!
Guy Pron !!!!!!

[Cr33p3r]

Nice, Curious on that distributor with how it performs.

[Fordguy77]

Nice, Curious on that distributor with how it performs.
X2. I have run DUI coils before but never have tried their distributors, I am hoping for another quality product. The cool part about the distributor is it is a 1 Wire set up, combined with the 3g alternator I am swapping in is it eliminates a fair amount of wiring. Not that there is to much to get rid of on these old rigs.

[Fordguy77]

Not really digging my new valve covers, but they were cheap and will do the trick. I imagine they might grow on me.

[Fordguy77]

Because of the height issues I had last time pulling the motor I am going to make my own custom spreader bar set up and it should help me gain an addition 6" of clearance. It will replace the chain and hook as a whole and bolt into the same slot as the chain did. If you look closely at the last picture you can see i had almost no clearance.

[CS79bronco]

Looks like when I pulled the motor out of my 79 Bronco. It still had the tires on it. My son rolled the hoist back while I tilted the pan around the center of the radiator support. Not going to be a problem going back with the 460, no grill & support to get in the way, maybe no fenders. Got to replace the support & pass side inner fender due to battery corrosion from long ago.

[Cr33p3r]

Where did you get the valve covers and did they set you back?

[Fordguy77]

Where did you get the valve covers and did they set you back?
I picked them up from Summit, but I had a coupon so they cost me $105 shipped to the door. My factory ones were to warped to use in my opinion and were questionable if they were gonna clear my valve train. So I ended up with the tall covers from ford racing. Now that I think about it I believe I may have a set on my parts rig too :bang:

[Funrover]

Looks to be coming along nicely!

[Fordguy77]

Moved along a bit today, as the last few pieces have started to roll in. I threw on the old valve covers, the oil pan, timing chain cover as well as a spare valley pan to protect the vitals from getting any spray paint in them. I just remembered I have a spare intake for this motor and will probably end up setting it on the valley pan so I can ensure all areas that need paint receive them, And everything else will be protected.

The pulleys and other misc brackets came back from the sand blasters today. Looks like they did a good job and it only cost me $35 at A1 Metal Stripping in Golden.

[The StRanger]

Its the little thing that make it right !!
And, Im thinkin on the valve covers. A little Ford blue paint in those black lines ????

[Fordguy77]

I was able to get the block painted up tonight after work. Just have to say I love Ford Tractor Gray on engines.

[Rick]

looks great...Nice work!:thumb:

[Fordguy77]

Found all of the stuff I need to switch over to a Ford Taurus 2-speed fan, and get rid of my mechanical fan. I wasn't really planning on doing this mod, but somehow my dad talked me into it. As weird as it is, I really like my power robbing 100% always on mechanical fans. But they do suck in traffic jams.

I also finished gathering all the parts up for my alternator upgrade. Good bye 65 amps and hello 130. Essentially a bolt in swap with some minor wiring, cost? $60 and that's with me buying a pre-made harness. Well worth it.

This weekend I am hoping to finish cleaning up the engine compartment, and get started on my steering column swap, and hopefully even get my pedal assembly swap started. Its a shame ford didn't offer the 400 with the 4spd. Granted the C6 isn't a bad transmission.

[The StRanger]

I was able to get the block painted up tonight after work. Just have to say I love Ford Tractor Gray on engines.

Looks damn good..

Iv always done Black blocks with Silver heads. Then do the pans & covers to match the rig ..

[Hypoid]

I just noticed the front sump pan. It caught my eye because my '74 came with a front sump, dented by the front axle. Gotta love those FEs! :)

[CS79bronco]

Its a shame ford didn't offer the 400 with the 4spd.
I guess you're talking about the auto 4 speed?

[Fordguy77]

I guess you're talking about the auto 4 speed?
No I was referring to the NP435. If you ordered te 400 you received a C6 regardless. They only put it behind the 351M at least that's what every piece of lititure I've found says.

[CS79bronco]

I thought the 400 in Broncos was available with the NP435. Never looked for it though. I got one if you need it, bellhousing, clutch, flywheel, linkage, maybe pedals too.

[Cr33p3r]

Chris you'll love the alltenator upgrade, my bronco already had it done when I bought it. Engine looks good!

[glacierpaul]

Really Nice Chris! I Like the Ford Racing Covers, Sams Idea Was Good Too.

[Fordguy77]

I thought the 400 in Broncos was available with the NP435. Never looked for it though. I got one if you need it, bellhousing, clutch, flywheel, linkage, maybe pedals too.
Thanks for the offer, however I've got a 79 bronco parts rig I'm using as a donor. If I need anything I'll let you know.

[Fordguy77]

Chris you'll love the alltenator upgrade, my bronco already had it done when I bought it. Engine looks good!
I'm hoping so. Granted I never had any problems running just 60amps but that was before I started adding electronic goodies. I keep meaning to get over and check out your rig but I can't ever seen to find a free moment.

[javaman34]

I'm hoping so. Granted I never had any problems running just 60amps but that was before I started adding electronic goodies. I keep meaning to get over and check out your rig but I can't ever seen to find a free moment.

I can't seem to get the time to get over to see it either. Something always seems to come up.

[Fordguy77]

I manged to clean up some of my spare parts today, as well as get both steering columns out of the rigs. A few minor differences between the 2, but over all should be able to make it would fairly painlessly.

[Fordguy77]

Some more parts showed up today. Because of my distributor'a size it required me to go with an air cleaner with 13" or less diameter. So I picked up a ford racing one for pretty cheap. The wiring loom for my spark plugs also came in. Should be a nice touch to keep the wires organized and out of the way. I ended up ordering a new Taurus fan as I haven't had much time to get to the yard to get one, and it was surprisingly cheap on RockAuto to just pick up a new one. It's going to open open my engine bay a bit as well. As it's not even as thick as my factory fan shroud.

Not to much left and I'll have all the parts gathered up.

[Cr33p3r]

Nice!

[Fordguy77]

Hopefully later this week I will be getting back to this project. I started swapping steering columns for the 4spd swap, and ran into an issue with the brake booster linkage. Luckily it looks like I can take the Booster Bracket off of the 79 Donor and just use that to match the peddle set up. Aside from cleaning up the engine bay and giving it a coat of paint, not much has happened. Heres the motor as shes currently sitting. I am going to use the stocker valve covers to drop the motor in to avoid damaging the new ones.

[Fordguy77]

Havent been able to do to much with this lately as work has been keeping me busy. Did manage to clean up the engine bay a bit, as well as get the motor a little further together today.
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfa1/t31.0-8/10694399_546710605431123_703244697989946207_o.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/t31.0-8/10257711_547013928734124_5231025029199000694_o.jpg
https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/t31.0-8/1980234_547013932067457_5284024587697073132_o.jpg
https://scontent-b-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10288721_485227574912760_5083430929069296755_n.jpg ?oh=a27494d0bac4c24eae827b239e2e92c3&oe=54C31F3A

[The StRanger]

very nice...

[Cr33p3r]

Can't wait to hear it run.

[Fordguy77]

Did a thing. Slowly but surely shes getting there.